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	<title>Comments on: responses to trevor, uly laz, etc re: obama haters</title>
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	<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/</link>
	<description>Piracy, space and post-Soviet conflicts. Also treehugging, mayhem and high weirdness.</description>
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		<title>By: Revolution &#8211; history and praxis. Technoccult interviews Johnny Brainwash &#124; Technoccult</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-10761</link>
		<dc:creator>Revolution &#8211; history and praxis. Technoccult interviews Johnny Brainwash &#124; Technoccult</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:17:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-10761</guid>
		<description>[...] Johnny Brainwash is an armchair activist and disaffected leftist. His past political activity has ranged from blockading logging roads with Wild Rockies Earth First to coordinating a state campaign for Nader in 2000, with lots of other stops along the way. He mostly organizes Discordian bullshit now, because when he fucks up, no forests get cut down and no one goes to jail. He blogs occasionally at Dysnomia and Shut Up You Are An Idiot. You can read his open letter to Obama-haters here and his follow-up here. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Johnny Brainwash is an armchair activist and disaffected leftist. His past political activity has ranged from blockading logging roads with Wild Rockies Earth First to coordinating a state campaign for Nader in 2000, with lots of other stops along the way. He mostly organizes Discordian bullshit now, because when he fucks up, no forests get cut down and no one goes to jail. He blogs occasionally at Dysnomia and Shut Up You Are An Idiot. You can read his open letter to Obama-haters here and his follow-up here. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Cain</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-968</link>
		<dc:creator>Cain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Dec 2008 12:08:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-968</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m highly cautious about Obama.  I am of the opinion that the sort of interests which converge around a President are not necessarily those which are well disposed to the &quot;dirty hippie/progressive&quot; faction of Democratic Party supporters.  As his appointments tend to show, he is picking DC insiders which, if anything, suggests a return to the Clinton years more than anything else (of course, the Clinton years were certainly better than the last 8, but on an objective level its not exactly brilliant).  Tom Daschle, Clinton and Larry Summers do not suggest anything beyond the sort of centrist, triangulating politics that Bubba excelled at.

That said, I do not think it is all bad.  While certainly such selections fall well below the expectations of an Obama government, I&#039;m not really concentrating there.

Like others have mentioned, Obama has mobilized a lot of support.  He got so far by embracing the progressive wing of the Democrats and by organizing grass roots support via the internet in a way which did not piss people off (unlike the Ron Paul crowd, for a contrast).  The thing is, a lot of that machinery, the mechanisms used for organizing all this, are still in place and available.  People are motivated and they are more engaged and perhaps that bodes well for the political culture in the country.

Now that the Republicans are engaging in a circular firing squad and Bush is on the way out, the need to get behind &quot;the opposition&quot; and play partisan to the Democrats may not be so vital, and we&#039;ll see some of them breaking ranks in order to try and keep Obama on the political straight and narrow.  Probably not in the Senate or administration itself, but perhaps a minority in Congress and various advocacy groups might.  It will be interesting to see the Netroots reaction, especially if Obama does knife the progressives in back, as I suspect he will.

I agree with making use of the historical moment as a premise.  People are charged up, they do want change and if a leader can be shown to not be providing that, then its entirely possible they will make other arragements, an endeavour I fully support.

I have more on this, but I shouldn&#039;t type so much when still half asleep - I&#039;ll try and come up with something more coherent later.  Hopefully my point is discernable among the gibberish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m highly cautious about Obama.  I am of the opinion that the sort of interests which converge around a President are not necessarily those which are well disposed to the &#8220;dirty hippie/progressive&#8221; faction of Democratic Party supporters.  As his appointments tend to show, he is picking DC insiders which, if anything, suggests a return to the Clinton years more than anything else (of course, the Clinton years were certainly better than the last 8, but on an objective level its not exactly brilliant).  Tom Daschle, Clinton and Larry Summers do not suggest anything beyond the sort of centrist, triangulating politics that Bubba excelled at.</p>
<p>That said, I do not think it is all bad.  While certainly such selections fall well below the expectations of an Obama government, I&#8217;m not really concentrating there.</p>
<p>Like others have mentioned, Obama has mobilized a lot of support.  He got so far by embracing the progressive wing of the Democrats and by organizing grass roots support via the internet in a way which did not piss people off (unlike the Ron Paul crowd, for a contrast).  The thing is, a lot of that machinery, the mechanisms used for organizing all this, are still in place and available.  People are motivated and they are more engaged and perhaps that bodes well for the political culture in the country.</p>
<p>Now that the Republicans are engaging in a circular firing squad and Bush is on the way out, the need to get behind &#8220;the opposition&#8221; and play partisan to the Democrats may not be so vital, and we&#8217;ll see some of them breaking ranks in order to try and keep Obama on the political straight and narrow.  Probably not in the Senate or administration itself, but perhaps a minority in Congress and various advocacy groups might.  It will be interesting to see the Netroots reaction, especially if Obama does knife the progressives in back, as I suspect he will.</p>
<p>I agree with making use of the historical moment as a premise.  People are charged up, they do want change and if a leader can be shown to not be providing that, then its entirely possible they will make other arragements, an endeavour I fully support.</p>
<p>I have more on this, but I shouldn&#8217;t type so much when still half asleep &#8211; I&#8217;ll try and come up with something more coherent later.  Hopefully my point is discernable among the gibberish.</p>
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		<title>By: V</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-963</link>
		<dc:creator>V</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Dec 2008 18:42:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-963</guid>
		<description>If Obama does well and makes some of the hope he sold come to fruition - excellent.
&amp; if he fails... the notion that our two-party system can ever deliver change becomes farcical and disproved and that majority of people who ardently want change from the corporate-statist-media-machine we have, will be forced to make it themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If Obama does well and makes some of the hope he sold come to fruition &#8211; excellent.<br />
&amp; if he fails&#8230; the notion that our two-party system can ever deliver change becomes farcical and disproved and that majority of people who ardently want change from the corporate-statist-media-machine we have, will be forced to make it themselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Uriah Zebadiah</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-951</link>
		<dc:creator>Uriah Zebadiah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 08:29:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-951</guid>
		<description>Now is clearly a good time to get moving on forming new powerful organizations, whatever your politics. I&#039;ve been churning on the subject for a long time, particularly since the election, and I think there is a very real opportunity to completely change the political landscape over the next decade or two. 

That being said, I think there&#039;s also an opportunity to create a vast organization made up of many loosely interconnected self-organizing networks united by a common basic agreement, one that reflects and appeals to both the Comedy-Central-mainstream and the proper radical, providing common services and opportunities, much as the conservative movement has done, capitalizing on existing communities and connecting them with a common narrative.

I think the main thing behind any movement is essentially this: those in power have proven themselves too incompetent and/or evil to continue to run things. We and people who agree with us should definitely be running things instead, because we would do a substantially better job of it. Power exists, so although  we want to distribute it more equally, we do still need to play the games of power in order to gain enough to ensure that we are not prevented from creating a more just world. 

We should talk more seriously on the subject sometime soon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now is clearly a good time to get moving on forming new powerful organizations, whatever your politics. I&#8217;ve been churning on the subject for a long time, particularly since the election, and I think there is a very real opportunity to completely change the political landscape over the next decade or two. </p>
<p>That being said, I think there&#8217;s also an opportunity to create a vast organization made up of many loosely interconnected self-organizing networks united by a common basic agreement, one that reflects and appeals to both the Comedy-Central-mainstream and the proper radical, providing common services and opportunities, much as the conservative movement has done, capitalizing on existing communities and connecting them with a common narrative.</p>
<p>I think the main thing behind any movement is essentially this: those in power have proven themselves too incompetent and/or evil to continue to run things. We and people who agree with us should definitely be running things instead, because we would do a substantially better job of it. Power exists, so although  we want to distribute it more equally, we do still need to play the games of power in order to gain enough to ensure that we are not prevented from creating a more just world. </p>
<p>We should talk more seriously on the subject sometime soon.</p>
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		<title>By: Trevor Blake</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-947</link>
		<dc:creator>Trevor Blake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 02:51:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-947</guid>
		<description>You honor me with such a thoughtful reply.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You honor me with such a thoughtful reply.</p>
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		<title>By: Sydney Familiar</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-945</link>
		<dc:creator>Sydney Familiar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 23:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-945</guid>
		<description>Thanks for posting this and part one. Now is the time to mobilize, I agree.

A very worthwhile read on the topic of staying involved is here too:

http://www.htmltimes.com/how-to-make-barack-obama-keep-his-promises.php</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for posting this and part one. Now is the time to mobilize, I agree.</p>
<p>A very worthwhile read on the topic of staying involved is here too:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.htmltimes.com/how-to-make-barack-obama-keep-his-promises.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.htmltimes.com/how-to-make-barack-obama-keep-his-promises.php</a></p>
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		<title>By: Heidi</title>
		<link>http://www.dysnomia.us/2008/11/responses-to-trevor-uly-laz-etc-re-obama-haters/comment-page-1/#comment-939</link>
		<dc:creator>Heidi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 20:41:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dysnomia.us/?p=384#comment-939</guid>
		<description>I remain cautiously optimistic that Obama may deliver more than we think he&#039;s capable of.  Those that disparage him for being part of the machine, I&#039;m not so sure.  His roots are in community organizing, and as I&#039;m sure he quickly found, you can&#039;t institute change unless you are part of the works that can institute change...politics.  As you said, politicos get things done.  

I myself found in getting more involved with the peace movement that there is learning curve between idealized values and actually working with others and making things happen.  If you work with more than 5 people, you are trying to move a many-headed monster with many legs going different directions, no matter how peaceful the intentions of individuals.  Change happens slowly and in small ways.  Yet some things do happen, such as a court victory that says we have a right as citizens to address our representatives, even if their offices are on private property.  Dedicated activists got themselves arrested, not at all dramatically, by attempting to speak to Gordon Smith about getting out of Iraq.

If people expect dramatic change happening quickly, they are bound for disappointment.

I had more to say but I gotta go.  I admire your thoughts on this and other worldly affairs and look forward to more.  More commentary on your links!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remain cautiously optimistic that Obama may deliver more than we think he&#8217;s capable of.  Those that disparage him for being part of the machine, I&#8217;m not so sure.  His roots are in community organizing, and as I&#8217;m sure he quickly found, you can&#8217;t institute change unless you are part of the works that can institute change&#8230;politics.  As you said, politicos get things done.  </p>
<p>I myself found in getting more involved with the peace movement that there is learning curve between idealized values and actually working with others and making things happen.  If you work with more than 5 people, you are trying to move a many-headed monster with many legs going different directions, no matter how peaceful the intentions of individuals.  Change happens slowly and in small ways.  Yet some things do happen, such as a court victory that says we have a right as citizens to address our representatives, even if their offices are on private property.  Dedicated activists got themselves arrested, not at all dramatically, by attempting to speak to Gordon Smith about getting out of Iraq.</p>
<p>If people expect dramatic change happening quickly, they are bound for disappointment.</p>
<p>I had more to say but I gotta go.  I admire your thoughts on this and other worldly affairs and look forward to more.  More commentary on your links!</p>
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